Vista or not to Vista, that is the questions

Race Bannon · Post by **Race Bannon** » Tue Nov 27, 2007 3:16 pm

I found this article on testing Vista vs. XP operation systems. I figured that some of you would find it interesting.

Windows XP Significantly Outperforms Vista, Tests Show

Windows XP trounced Windows Vista in all tests, regardless of the versions used or the amount of memory running on the computer, says Devil Mountain Software.
By Paul McDougall
InformationWeek
November 27, 2007 11:49 AM

In the latest Mac versus PC ad, that put-upon Windows guy quietly concedes he's "downgrading" from Vista to XP. He may have good reason: new tests show that the older XP runs common productivity tasks significantly faster than Microsoft (NSDQ: MSFT)'s newest operating system.

Researchers at Devil Mountain Software, a Florida-based developer of performance management tools, have posted data from their most recent Windows performance tests -- and Vista, even after it's been upgraded to the new Service Pack 1 beta package, is shown to be a laggard.

"The hoped for performance fixes [from Vista SP1] that Microsoft has been hinting at never materialized," said Devil Mountain researchers, in a blog post summarizing their results.

The researchers compared patched and unpatched versions of Vista and XP running Microsoft Office on a dual-core Dell notebook. The results revealed the time taken to complete Office productivity tasks such as the creation of a compound document and presentation materials.

Devil Mountain researchers ran a mix of tests comparing existing versions of the operating systems -- the original Vista and XP SP2 -- and versions that had been patched with the latest updates -- Vista SP1 beta and XP SP3 beta. Tests were also run on machines with 1 Gbyte and 2 Gbytes of memory.

Windows XP trounced Windows Vista in all tests -- regardless of the versions used or the amount of memory running on the computer. In fact, XP proved to be roughly twice as fast as Vista in most of the tests.

For instance, notebooks running Vista SP1 took more than 80 seconds to complete a series of Office tasks in the OfficeBench test suite, while notebooks running Windows XP SP2 completed the tasks in just over 40 seconds.

What's more, the tests showed that the resource-hungry Vista gobbles up most of the additional RAM added to a computer. By upgrading a notebook running Vista SP1 from 1 Gbyte to 2 Gbytes of memory, "we managed to achieve a 'whopping' 4% improvement in OfficeBench throughput," the researchers noted.
The test results are the latest black eye for Windows Vista -- an operating system that Microsoft unveiled in January amid much fanfare but which has since failed to capture the hearts and minds of computers users in both the home and business markets.

A recent InformationWeek survey found that 30% of businesses have no plans to upgrade their computers to Vista -- ever.

Many users have voiced worries about Vista's resource requirements and compatibility with older applications and peripherals. The concerns have prompted some PC makers, includingDell ( Dell) and Hewlett-Packard (NYSE: HP), to reintroduce XP as an option on certain systems.

Microsoft rival Apple is seizing on the Vista backlash to promote its new Leopard operating system. Its latest ad is an attempt to portray Microsoft as a company that's tone deaf to user concerns about Vista.

"Ask not what Vista can do for you, but what you can do for Vista," says the PC guy, posing as a politico. Given the latest research, an increasing number of Windows users may end up seeking a new candidate.

Jimmy · Post by **Jimmy** » Tue Nov 27, 2007 7:47 pm

Good post Race,

This is why I will stick w/ XP Pro for sometime

Note to all NVidia Video Card users w/ XP: the latest Nvideo card driver update (series 6,7 & 8)dated November 6th will crash your Machine. I found this out the hard way, once you reboot and it installs the new drivers, your computer will start up normally but you will not have a keyboard or mouse. I even pluged in an old PS2 mouse to see if I could do anything tying in directly to the MOBO and it would not work. For more info check out the Nvidia website forums.

Felony · Post by **Felony** » Tue Nov 27, 2007 9:05 pm

Sorry, but it beg to differ. :pc:

All of the above about Vista, which was so graciously laid out by Race, has been said by hundreds. And just like any new OS product on the market, the negative always outways the good. If some of you can think back to when XP was first released, all of the above was said exactly about XP. Now, just like Windows 98SE then, XP is the greatest thing since sliced bread. Almost no one uses 98 any longer only XP. All of the people that were bad mouthing XP are now die hard fans of the OS. I've said it once before in a similar post on the forums, noboby likes change.

And what is with all of the bechmark tests that are performed on these OS's. Come on, who is going to set all of the video card settings as high as they can with only a 256 or 512MB video card and try to run F.E.A.R or COD4. Also, in case you didn't know they run these high performace games like this while running a huge resource hog like 3D Mark, Cinebench or PC Mark06, benchmark testing software. Um, it's a no brainer, how many of you are going to have 4 different applications opened all doing their own processes while trying to play a high performance game. No contest for any OS.

All new OS's are limited to consumer preference on release, Windows 95, 98, 98SE, 2000(Bad Example), XP, Linux, Unix, Red Hat and now Vista. Once all of the bumps are ironed out, they are the best OS for the every increasing technologies. I mean let's face it, technologies change, especially in the computer industry. Hardware technologies are literally changing every month. The software for these technologies has to maintain it's momentum forward or we all might as well get use to playing MOH on an Abacus.

With that said, as a consumer looking forward to the technologies that are hiding in a clean room somewhere, bring on the "Technological Age"!

Jimmy · Post by **Jimmy** » Tue Nov 27, 2007 11:57 pm

UberSoldier wrote:Sorry, but it beg to differ. :pc:

All of the above about Vista, which was so graciously laid out by Race, has been said by hundreds. And just like any new OS product on the market, the negative always outways the good. If some of you can think back to when XP was first released, all of the above was said exactly about XP. Now, just like Windows 98SE then, XP is the greatest thing since sliced bread. Almost no one uses 98 any longer only XP. All of the people that were bad mouthing XP are now die hard fans of the OS. I've said it once before in a similar post on the forums, noboby likes change.

And what is with all of the bechmark tests that are performed on these OS's. Come on, who is going to set all of the video card settings as high as they can with only a 256 or 512MB video card and try to run F.E.A.R or COD4. Also, in case you didn't know they run these high performace games like this while running a huge resource hog like 3D Mark, Cinebench or PC Mark06, benchmark testing software. Um, it's a no brainer, how many of you are going to have 4 different applications opened all doing their own processes while trying to play a high performance game. No contest for any OS.

All new OS's are limited to consumer preference on release, Windows 95, 98, 98SE, 2000(Bad Example), XP, Linux, Unix, Red Hat and now Vista. Once all of the bumps are ironed out, they are the best OS for the every increasing technologies. I mean let's face it, technologies change, especially in the computer industry. Hardware technologies are literally changing every month. The software for these technologies has to maintain it's momentum forward or we all might as well get use to playing MOH on an Abacus.

With that said, as a consumer looking forward to the technologies that are hiding in a clean room somewhere, bring on the "Technological Age"!

As you will note Uber, I said "I would run XP for now". As I did w/ XP, I waited almost a year until they worked the bugs out. It has nothing to do w/ the technoligy only common sence not to throw money at a half completed product. It has been the trend of MS ever since Windows 95 to get something out the door working or not and then work to fix it later, same goes for the latest games.

And BTW, COD 4 and FEAR run very smooth on a single 7800GTX 256mb card on factory settings. :cheeks:

Felony · Post by **Felony** » Wed Nov 28, 2007 9:26 am

:y: You missed the point of my post totally. :y:

This was not a bash at you and you not wanting to upgrade to Vista. If you actually read my post, my reply was to point out how everyone is so quick to complain about a product without giving it a fair and logical shot and about the tests benchmarker's use and the outcome. I pointed out from Races post that most of the people that benchmark these new OS's are all software developers trying to find flaws, especially if they are biased to a particular company, i.e. Microsoft. Once they find they flaws that is all they report to the consumer.

Everyone who does not like Vista, NOT JUST JIMMY, will eventually like this OS the best, just like they did when switching to XP.

Jimmy wrote:And BTW, COD 4 and FEAR run very smooth on a single 7800GTX 256mb card on factory settings.

Again like I posted above, they use unorthodox settings when bechmarking an OS, trying to make the system fail. You use factory settings to play these games, they use MAX settings and push all hardware and software to it's limits and then complain that it does not keep up.

I have been using Vista for the past year with absolutley NO problems what so ever! And it's not my ability of resolving matters because I'm in the IT field. I did not perform any out of the ordinary functions to make Vista work. I just added an Anti-Virus, MOH, some Torrent sites, and a few more games, like any normal user would, without any difficulty what so ever.

:pc: Again, this is not a post to bash Jimmy or Race. I am just expressing my opinion about benchmark testing and biased opinions about OS's! :pc:

Race Bannon · Post by **Race Bannon** » Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:27 am

Uber and Jimmy.
I do not see any of the posts as a personal attack on my behalf. The one thing that I learned and value is the options of other people that work in the same field. I lean something every day, and I lean the most from my Peers.

I run several different operating systems at home and work. In fact I am running Vista on the laptop that I am typing this all out on. The majority of my machines at home are running XP, but I also have one that runs Vista and three different distributions of Linux and as with any OS (Operating System), you can find both positives and negatives about them.

The reason why I posted the article that I found on the web was to just pass on some information about operating systems. I find that the most common problem with people that are trying to make decisions about technology is that they lack the proper knowledge on the subject. The person is either never been told or they just don’t understand what is being told to them. I have to be very careful at work when someone here at work asks me a question. Most of the people here don’t speak techie and all they here most of the time from other techs is jokingly referred as technobable.

My gaming machine at home is running XP and I will continue to run this OS for quite some time. I know that eventually I will need to move everything to Vista, but after spending all day fixing things that other people break. So when I am not at work I would prefer not to have to work on my computer at home, I would rather shoot, Hitman, Squeek, Roadrunner, Nails, Jimmie and generally anyone else. :hitman:

Jimmy · Post by **Jimmy** » Wed Nov 28, 2007 2:00 pm

Uber, no offence taken buddy, I have learned and yes somtimes the hard way when something new comes out I just don't rush out to buy it. I like letting someone else buy it and wait and see how the technoligy progresses (eyes and ears wide open), not to sound like an old fart but a little wiser as I get older. lol

I am just an old dumb carpenter who trully loves technoligy and got my kids into it early w/ the Commidor 64 back in the early 80's, I don't know what I would do w/o Excel, Word and Outlook . My son-in-law works for Microsoft as a contractor marketing the new VOIP (voice over internet protical) which basically is a secure TS. He has to get all the new teckie stuff when it comes out which is why he will always be broke lol.

You and Race are way over my head on Bios, Benchmarking, programing etc, no comprendea'
nuff said :makeup:

Felony · Post by **Felony** » Wed Nov 28, 2007 4:11 pm

I wise philosopher once said...:look: Can't we all just get along! (Los Angeles California Rodney King, April 29 1992.)

No worries brother,

I just wanted to share my opinion on the matter.

See ya on the field.

FragQueen · Post by **FragQueen** » Wed Nov 28, 2007 6:13 pm

.........and as another wise philosopher once said....opinions are like..................bellybuttons, yeah that's it...bellybuttons....everybody has one. (philosopher unknown).

I'm with ya Jimmy, I don't need the aggravation. When they have it worked over I'll probably jump on board. That's why we have lab rats. What I have, XP works for me now. I used to jump on all the latest and greatest but got tired of the headaches, expense and aggravation. To the more technically savvy it's a challenge, to me it's a migraine. Game on!

Frag

TMT MEDAL OF HONOR MODDING · Post by **ViPER** » Wed Nov 28, 2007 6:34 pm

All the new fangled crap sucks - I perfer DOS

Major Privates · Post by **Major Privates** » Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:31 pm

Sort of on topic, but really just looking for some help - since I bought my new machine with Vista I've had a lot of trouble running MOH. I installed nHancer for nvidia cards and things are a little better. My frame rate slows right down and I get lag when I get close to another player in the game. Anyone else experiencing this?

Felony · Post by **Felony** » Fri Nov 30, 2007 5:16 pm

I would set your video setting in MOH to default. This uses the default sttings that your video card can handle.

To increase your FPS, Hit the ~ key. To get this hold the shift and hit the key to the left of 1. This brings up your console, you can type this in; com_maxfps60.

This should resolve any lag and FPS issues that you may have.

Good Luck!

Major Privates · Post by **Major Privates** » Sat Dec 01, 2007 8:29 am

Thanks Uber,
I will try this out. Thanks for the help.

Private_Lapdance · Post by **Private_Lapdance** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 3:15 pm

Well I might seem old fashioned but, I still run Win2k. Seriously, Im not fibbing. Now that support has gone for win2k in the form of service packs and updates, I'm thinking WinXp-provided I can run DX10 on it. If not, I'm building a new pc in the new year and will give Vista a chance. From what I've experienced from new systems at a store, I find the boot time to be s l o w, which is following Microsoft's tradition of producing ever increasingly massive releases of "bloatware". I think the slow insidious march towards 64 bit processing needs to pick up the pace, especially now with the availability and low cost of quad core processors with massive amounts of onboard cache. In 32bit mode, I think waiting for Vista to boot is akin to standing in line to take a leak a hockey game with a belly full of beer- slow, painful but par for the course. Hopefully it gets better in 64bit mode. Come on linux, hurry up and get useful. :pc: